About to finish a bachelor of finance – waste of time starting a BSc in Math or CS?

[Magnus Jnr]

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[bigbadwolf]

Are you at Oslo or at NTSU in Trondheim? And isn't your higher ed free so it's just a question of time and not of money?

 

[Magnus Jnr]

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[Daniel Duffy]

I think I would be able to complete a BSc in Mathematics or Computer Science in my home country (Norway) in about 2 years with credit transfer from this degree.

A maths degree in 2 years is a bit short?

 

[Magnus Jnr]

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[Daniel Duffy]

Knowing all this is great.
However, it is veering in the direction of pure maths which is less practical than numerical analysis/algorithms/progtamming.

 

[Magnus Jnr]

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[Daniel Duffy]

All I can say is my personal preference: I would _not_ do CS in general because not enough maths or _practical_ programming in general. I would do maths and learn programming in parallel.

And don't forget: _Numerical_ Linear Algebra!

 

[Moatie]

Why not this degree: http://www.uio.no/studier/program/mit/studieretninger/ffr/oppbygging/? It has both "Object-oriented programming" and Algorithms and Datastructrures".

And are you currently at BI? It is possible to do it in two years (some in my class did that), but that requires a lot of work. And your grades will suffer from this. What are you planning to do after you complete such a degree?

 

[Magnus Jnr]

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[Daniel Duffy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerical_linear_algebra

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_algebra

LA is the theoretical underpinning for NLA

 

[Moatie]

Yes, by chance I came across the MIT degree today. It looks very interesting and probably more suitable from a quant finance perspective. Are you doing this degree?

I have just finished the degree and have only positive things to say about it. Bernt Øksendal and Fred Benth (Very well respected professors in Mathematical Finance) are also there. I'm taking the MSc in Mathematics and Finance at Imperial the coming year and I think the MIT-degree has been a good preparation.

 

[Magnus Jnr]

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[Moatie]

Congrats on getting accepted into the MSc at Imperial.

Would you mine if I sent you a personal message and maybe got your email so I could ask you a few questions?

Thanks! PM me and I will answer as best as I can!

 

[bigbadwolf]

Thanks for replying bigbadwolf.

Yes, ideally I would like to study in Oslo (UiO), but I could move to Trondheim and NTNU if you think that is a better option? I don't really know that much about what they have to offer in Trondheim.

You are correct, higher ed is free, but there is the cost of living (without a full time job). But I guess time is the main "issue". But what is another 2-3 years of undergraduate study if you look at the big picture?

Do you know much about UiO or NTNU?

NTNU is Norway's main science and engineering university. Oslo has a nice but small math department. Either will do for learning some serious math. I think there are four other universities in Norway but I know nothing about them. With regard to math, the dictum of "less haste, more speed" holds true. Try to do it fast and you'll suffer not only in grades but, more importantly, in conceptual mastery.

The program at UiO described here is not ideal. The foundational programming course is in Python, which is fine. But the OO course is in Java rather than C++. The math finance course seems to lack a stochastic calculus component (though there is a stochastic processes course). But that's okay since I think this is an undergrad program (?). If there's a numerical analysis course there, I missed seeing it.

I think the program should be fine for European finance masters, which tend to be weak on the programming side and focus more on math and finance. Won't be so good for American quant finance masters, which assume a strong coding background.

 

[Moatie]

The program at UiO described here is not ideal. The foundational programming course is in Python, which is fine. But the OO course is in Java rather than C++.

Both the OO course and "algorithms and datastructures" are in Java, although pseudo-code is used a lot in the later course. Although not optimal, is the transition from Java to C++ that big?

The math finance course seems to lack a stochastic calculus component (though there is a stochastic processes course). But that's okay since I think this is an undergrad program (?)

The math finance course has no stochastic calculus component. It only uses discrete time. We used this book by Pliska which is very rigorous and mathematical. And yes, this is an undergrad program. There are also a couple of elective courses where you could take for example Stochastic Analysis, but I think this is maybe a bit heavy for an undergrad course? And in the project at the end you can certainly study stochastic calculus if you want.

If there's a numerical analysis course there, I missed seeing it.

You could take this course, but I think this is also a bit heavy. There is also a course in Numerical Linear Algebra you can take. And there are also some numerical analysis integrated in MAT-INF1100.

I think the program should be fine for European finance masters, which tend to be weak on the programming side and focus more on math and finance. Won't be so good for American quant finance masters, which assume a strong coding background.

Which subjects do you think are missing in this degree? You can take PDE's and Parallell Programming as electives so you have 50 of 180 ECTS in CS. In PDE's we use Matlab or Python and in PP we use C.

I think the program should be fine for European finance masters, which tend to be weak on the programming side and focus more on math and finance.

Did you btw mean European Mathematical Finance masters?

 

[bigbadwolf]

Both the OO course and "algorithms and datastructures" are in Java, although pseudo-code is used a lot in the later course. Although not optimal, is the transition from Java to C++ that big?

No. I just think it's a bad first language. The ones I prefer are Scheme, Lisp, Python, and C. You can read more negative things about Java here and here.

The math finance course has no stochastic calculus component. It only uses discrete time. We used this book by Pliska which is very rigorous and mathematical. And yes, this is an undergrad program. There are also a couple of elective courses where you could take for example Stochastic Analysis, but I think this is maybe a bit heavy for an undergrad course? And in the project at the end you can certainly study stochastic calculus if you want.

It is heavy for an undergrad program but if done properly it means one can hit the ground running in a graduate program. The good MFE programs tend to do too much too fast, so prior exposure comes in handy.

You could take this course, but I think this is also a bit heavy. There is also a course in Numerical Linear Algebra you can take. And there are also some numerical analysis integrated in MAT-INF1100.

Course description is a bit vague ("interpolation and approximation"). Ideal would be a course in numerical analysis using MATLAB or maybe even C++ that culminates in numerical solutions to ODEs and PDEs.

Which subjects do you think are missing in this degree? You can take PDE's and Parallell Programming as electives so you have 50 of 180 ECTS in CS. In PDE's we use Matlab or Python and in PP we use C.

The PDE course is fine. As I think about it, the point I want to get across is ideally you want courses where the programming and the math interact with one another. From a quant perspective, you don't want mere programming courses and nor do you want mere math courses. For a fine example of what I mean, take a look at Klein's Coding the Matrix. Or Brandimarte's Numerical Methods in Finance and Economics.

Did you btw mean European Mathematical Finance masters?

Yes.

 

[Daniel Duffy]

Although not optimal, is the transition from Java to C++ that big?

In a word, YES.

Java for Java is great, Java for C++ is almost useless. Need to do a detox first, I am not kidding.

 

[Daniel Duffy]

As I think about it, the point I want to get across is ideally you want courses where the programming and the math interact with one another. From a quant perspective, you don't want mere programming courses and nor do you want mere math courses.

Bang on accurate.

 

[John Heisenberg]

Why not go for a Masters in CS? I don't think a full undergrad degree in CS is necessary for a masters. Depending on the program you could get by with a few fundamental pre courses.