Mathematics for non math savvy

[tPredictor]

My question is can all mathematics be reduced to basic operations such moving, comparison, etc? Are there any mathematics that would offer any other perspective?

 

[euroazn]

You're going to have rephrase your question.
If what you're asking is, can I get by without calculus for the mathematics used in quantitative finance, the answer is no.

 

[tPredictor]

No, that's not the question. The question is fundamentally can all of mathematics be reduced to set of operations which can be understood by the most basic of logical arguments such as moving something from point a to b, comparing for equality, or performing a basic mathematical operation (which is a form of moving). If not then can you give an example and describe a mathematical concept that can not be reduced? Is all math movement?

As a second question, I want to know if the human memory is at the limit of information theory ? I mean that given a limited amount of data and the mind must process this to retrieve something, we can imagine that there is a mathematical limit to finding the correct solution which will be based on entropy, time, and data provided. I would like to see a diagram provided that shows me where the human brain/mind is on the continuum.

 

[Connor]

No, that's not the question. The question is fundamentally can all of mathematics be reduced to set of operations which can be understood by the most basic of logical arguments such as moving something from point a to b, comparing for equality, or performing a basic mathematical operation (which is a form of moving). If not then can you give an example and describe a mathematical concept that can not be reduced? Is all math movement?

As a second question, I want to know if the human memory is at the limit of information theory ? I mean that given a limited amount of data and the mind must process this to retrieve something, we can imagine that there is a mathematical limit to finding the correct solution which will be based on entropy, time, and data provided. I would like to see a diagram provided that shows me where the human brain/mind is on the continuum.

To your first question I'm going to guess yes, otherwise how would computers do the math?

 

[Connor]

I am entirely too sober to enter this discussion...

That can be solved easily enough

 

[MSFHQ]

Can a square peg fit in a round hole?

Dude, everything in life can be simplified. That doesn't mean you can handle a MFE if you can't do calculus. People who do MFE's love math and want to work as a quant. If you hate math or struggle with it at the basic level why the hell would you want to surround yourself with it.

 

[koupparis]

It's true you can break down pretty much any maths and have a computer do it in simple steps, that includes proofs. But the amount of work needed grows, let's say, exponentially at the maths gets harder. You have to work really hard to break everything down into the basic operations and comparisons.

 

[bob]

My question is can all mathematics be reduced to basic operations such moving, comparison, etc?

Hm. Not sure how precisely you mean the question, but you may want to read a bit about Goedel's incompleteness theorems. In that context, the answer to this question is no.

 

[koupparis]

I don't think Goedel's incompleteness theorems have much to do with reducing mathematics to simple first principles. Proving something is true, and proving mathematics is complete are what Goedel's theorems relate to.

However taking existing maths, which is correct, we can reduce it to simple operations.

 

[Neuron]

Can a square peg fit in a round hole?

Dude, everything in life can be simplified. That doesn't mean you can handle a MFE if you can't do calculus. People who do MFE's love math and want to work as a quant. If you hate math or struggle with it at the basic level why the hell would you want to surround yourself with it.

I agree with everything you mention except the last sentence. Why do people automatically assume, just because you struggle or hate something you shouldn't do it? Maybe people hate things because they struggle with them or don't understand. This doesn't mean they shouldn't do it or learn it if it is something they truly want to do. People who are good at math or code and want to become great could face the same level of frustrating and misunderstandings as someone going from being bad to just good. The key thing here is, because you want to learn and understand it and not be "locked out" because you don't

 

[tPredictor]

Very good points. I will add that my question had nothing to do with MFE, my preference or non preference for maths, or my ability to do maths. My question really stem from my experience in programming and getting somehow "bored" with logic/computation.

As per your speculations, I do both enjoy and not enjoy math. Everything I do has to be applied. Math is an ends to a mean to me and nothing more. I am more driven by ideas, inventions, concepts. Yet, math often presents itself. I want the result from the math but am not concerned about the math itself. And by result, it depends on want my goal is. As an aside, it is surprisingly cheap to purchase intelligence. Of course, it is beyond my means but in terms of a businesses means, very cheap.

As for my ability, I am hard pressed on this one. I did achieve in the top of my class but that was partially due to superior teaching and my desire to win. My natural fluency with numbers is quite weak. I do suspect that a specialized area of the brain is involved in the mathematics because my mathematical ability has not kept pace with my other abilities.

I agree with everything you mention except the last sentence. Why do people automatically assume, just because you struggle or hate something you shouldn't do it? Maybe people hate things because they struggle with them or don't understand. This doesn't mean they shouldn't do it or learn it if it is something they truly want to do. People who are good at math or code and want to become great could face the same level of frustrating and misunderstandings as someone going from being bad to just good. The key thing here is, because you want to learn and understand it and not be "locked out" because you don't

 

[MSFHQ]

You might want to learn something and understand it, but if you are in class with people who naturally love math and succeed in math you are always going to be behind the curve. Struggling with someone in an intense graduate level program is a receipt for not getting a job. If you want to do it for your own enjoyment, fine, but all I am saying is an MFE program is going to be a brutal learning ground for someone just curious.

 

[ThinkDifferent]

why do you ask?